Question:
declared: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -On Tue, 28 Jan 2003 at 01:25:51, Stu Redman (Stu Redman Mike, I don’t understand what you mean. Did you give him your password? To cut a long story short, the bank account number on my paypal account is the same as I quoted him to pay me with. When I couldn’t remember the random password, I went to paypal security and it said "answer one of these questions that only you know the answer to", so I filled in my account number and I was back in my account If I could do it, then so could he. I assume everyone has to have a bank account recorded in order to withdraw funds, so it would be a good place to start.
oic, a good reason not to use your bank account # as a hint. so it wasn’t a bad thing that "happened", it was a bad thing that "could of happened" where you lost me was with the stuff on your personal comp. robert 36 years of providing clues to the clueless at no extra charge.
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Did. No paper checks generated as in your example. No personal presentation of the paper check for cashing as in your example.
Did you? <snip Sometimes they make up checks with your account info and their fake name.
Sure sounds like a paper check to me.
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Did. No paper checks generated as in your example. No personal presentation of the paper check for cashing as in your example. Did you? <snip Sometimes they make up checks with your account info and their fake name. Sure sounds like a paper check to me.
Well, whatever.. The discussion started with thing about SWIFT and wire transfer. Yes, I concede, I missed that small comment. Anyone could "print" a check with someone’s bank account numbers on it. And if it looks good enough and reads in their machines, it can be cashed. And can cash a bunch of them until the person finds out. But I was referring the major diff of pulling money via wire out of one’s account. Mac
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You can purchas the software and paper stock at any home office store such as staples. You can also order checks from vendors via mail and telephone. You just give them the information. Your social security number is requested for all sorts of things in the US. I was just at a new doctor’s office and they require it "for insurance purposes"
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – says… New guy to ebay, tried to pay me by paypal, but he wasn’t verified yet, so asked for other payment methods such as internet banking payment etc. I told him my sort code and account number At the same time, reading about passwords, I made all of my passwords more secure by using random mixtures of letters and numbers Then I forgot to save it in my password protected organiser, so I had to complete security. Believe it or not, just completing my account number was sufficient for me to regain control of my account Before you say I shouldn’t give him my details, this could happen to anyone – e.g. you may pay someone small amounts by paypal, large amounts by cheque. The receiver will have your email address (paypal login) and account number – enough to do what I did. Very scary indeed This is a very confusing post. You seem to be talking about your actual bank account number and your paypal account. With your bank account routing stuff, they can only PUT money in there. With your PayPal account, they need your password. I don’t see how these interact? Obviously, if someone has your PayPal password, they can do all kinds of things, including draining money from your bank account. Wanna clear that up? Mac actually, With a swift (or in the us ABA) and the account number, there is a lot of damage that can be done. As a manager of a bigger bank, I see it all the time. Sometimes they make up checks with your account info and their fake name. Other cases, they pay bills claiming to be you. (They never pay your bills) The possiblies are endless. Then as the account holder you are forced to file claims and hope that you have enough money to last until the claim is settled. This can gone on for months. In the meantime, collection agents call to make good on checks written by someone else.You may not be able to write a check to your local market that you used for 20+ years. I’m toally bemused. What’s a ’swift’ for instance? and how can someone ‘make up a cheque’, aren’t cheques issued by banks? Even if an enterprising con artist had the means to forge a cheque the account name, number and branch code would have to match and surely no bank would allow a bill to be paid that wasn’t in the name and address of the account holder. If you really are a bank manager I would suggest your lack of very basic security is appalling. Please understand that next to your social security number,banking information is just as valuable. Your bank information will only allow people to put money into your account, not draw from it. You give that information out every time you use a cheque or debit card anyway. As to SS numbers, the only organisation with the legal right to ask for this are the ones involved in making an SS claim and your employer. In the UK, a demand by an unauthorised person or organisation for a NINO (the UK equivalent) is a fraudulent act. Even the police cannot obtain it.
Response:
oic, a good reason not to use your bank account # as a hint. so it wasn’t a bad thing that "happened", it was a bad thing that "could of happened" where you lost me was with the stuff on your personal comp. robert
An interesting addendum to this, I changed my password at PayPal recently, the fields needed were Old Password, New Password, and two choices of "personal info" questions. #1, CC number or #2 Bank account number. period. If you doubt this, go to their secure page and change your password. Those are the only "personal hint" choices given. proudmari
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assuming the other person knew the answers to your "secret question only you would know the answer to". Might I suggest a tougher question.
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To cut a long story short, the bank account number on my paypal account is the same as I quoted him to pay me with. When I couldn’t remember the random password, I went to paypal security and it said "answer one of these questions that only you know the answer to", so I filled in my account number and I was back in my account
Wow. IC. Mac
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That seems like a significantly different matter than what we’re bandying about. Merely forging checks. About the same as grabbing someone’s checkbook and writing checks to yourself and cashing them. Mac
I said the EXACT same concept as StefC and expanded on it. Re-read his post, please. Simply grabbing someone’s checkbook and writing checks out of it requires a forged signature, anyways. Drafts don’t. NOT the same thing. Besides, who’s going to fly out from California or wherever to break into your house to steal your checkbook when they can just accept a personal check from you on eBay that contains all the vital info they need and create the drafts from the comfort of their own home or office and NOT have to worry about forging a signature? I agree 100% with StefC – next to your SSN your banking info is just as valuable.
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assuming the other person knew the answers to your "secret question only you would know the answer to". Might I suggest a tougher question.
As I’m reading it, they used "what is your bank account number?" as one of their secret questions. — “Behind every successful organization stands one person who knows the secret of how to keep the managers away from anything truly important.”
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That seems like a significantly different matter than what we’re bandying about. Merely forging checks. About the same as grabbing someone’s checkbook and writing checks to yourself and cashing them. Mac I said the EXACT same concept as StefC and expanded on it. Re-read his post, please.
Did. No paper checks generated as in your example. No personal presentation of the paper check for cashing as in your example. In your example, a valid paper check was generated. In a stolen checkbook situation, the same happens. In both cases, the authorization to do so, ie "signature" is forged. Mac
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On Tue, 28 Jan 2003 at 13:58:01, Poot410 (Poot410 assuming the other person knew the answers to your "secret question only you would know the answer to". Might I suggest a tougher question.
Security was Bank account number OR Credit card number OR The answer to the two secret questions I was amazed at how little I needed to give to get back into my account — Mike
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actually, With a swift (or in the us ABA) and the account number, there is a lot of damage that can be done.
Isn’t that the information on every check? Deborah Stevenson
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actually, With a swift (or in the us ABA) and the account number, there is a lot of damage that can be done. Isn’t that the information on every check?
For my bank, they need an entry routing number for the whole state, that’s not on the check. Also, I’m unsure about this SWIFT thing. I’ve given out the SWIFT number for my bank to foreign folks who have wired money. No probs. And they assured me that folks could only PLACE money in my account, that even I couldn’t send money out without showing up in person. I even have online banking and can’t do it from there. This is largest bank in the state, so I guess I’ll take them at their word. Then again, this IS just Tennersee 
So StefC’s post about the dangers of SWIFT (whatever exactly that is), caught my eye. I may ask again. Also, though, I try to keep less than a grand in that account at all times, as basically use it specifically for Paypal/BillPoint and the once in a blue moon wire. BTW, I’m REALLY going to miss BillPoint. Normal customers have already balked at PayPal, and once they hit $2K limit, they’ll probably be customers no more. Sigh. Mac
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On Tue, 28 Jan 2003 at 01:25:51, Stu Redman (Stu Redman Mike, I don’t understand what you mean. Did you give him your password?
To cut a long story short, the bank account number on my paypal account is the same as I quoted him to pay me with. When I couldn’t remember the random password, I went to paypal security and it said "answer one of these questions that only you know the answer to", so I filled in my account number and I was back in my account If I could do it, then so could he. I assume everyone has to have a bank account recorded in order to withdraw funds, so it would be a good place to start. — Mike
Response:
I worked for a payroll company where a guy got busted. He was using their check printer to generate checks for other people’s accounts. All told he had cleared $75,000 by the time they caught him. Just punched in the account # and routing #, zipped out a draft, presented it for cashing to a random party store, and the party stores were having no problems cashing the checks. So much for security.
That seems like a significantly different matter than what we’re bandying about. Merely forging checks. About the same as grabbing someone’s checkbook and writing checks to yourself and cashing them. Mac
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Remember, I added PayPal when my good customers started asking for it. If I hear from enough people that they want to pay via regular credit card and not through PayPal, you can pretty well bet that it will be an option I’ll consider. Cynthia
Yep, I grok that, Cyn. If only I could find a merchant account that didn’t demand some rotten combination of a monthly minimum, expensive card swiper, or extra fees for phone verification, I’d be happy to pay somewhat more % than I’m giving PayPal. Mac
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – actually, With a swift (or in the us ABA) and the account number, there is a lot of damage that can be done. Isn’t that the information on every check? For my bank, they need an entry routing number for the whole state, that’s not on the check. Well, in times past, if I wanted to say, pay my credit card bill by phone, all the info they needed from me WAS on the check. Maybe they have a file of the other stuff, I dunno. Yeah, but we’re talking international payments here. I think all banks have a specific routing number into the state in which they operate for that. I too, have a couple of things charged every month out of my checking account, and you’re right, they just need what’s on the check for US stuff.
Ah, OK… BTW, I’m REALLY going to miss BillPoint. Normal customers have already balked at PayPal, and once they hit $2K limit, they’ll probably be customers no more. Sigh. I will miss Billpoint too. It was just so much easier for an eBay newbie to pay that way. Cynthia That’s for sure, but I’m more concerned about general biz payments. How many of the public at large are gonna give up their bank info, confirm it, all that tripe, to spend more than two grand with their own plastic?
I agree… I’d say a lot of them will balk. Once I’m up in North Dakota, and attempting to run my own business… I am going to find out, no doubt! Lots of my customers are used to PayPal and are already verified… but there are others who might not buy if they couldn’t use credit card and might NOT want to do the PayPal dance to get rid of the spending limit. I may well have to get a merchant account. And I’m not a big enough biz to where a merchant account wouldn’t really hurt, as I don’t even do the minimums on plastic most months.
Well, I don’t plan to rush into it. At best, it’s going to take me a while to get going anyway, I’ll be learning whole new sets of skills. But once up and rolling for production, I’ll see how it plays out. Remember, I added PayPal when my good customers started asking for it. If I hear from enough people that they want to pay via regular credit card and not through PayPal, you can pretty well bet that it will be an option I’ll consider. Cynthia
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – actually, With a swift (or in the us ABA) and the account number, there is a lot of damage that can be done. Isn’t that the information on every check? For my bank, they need an entry routing number for the whole state, that’s not on the check. Well, in times past, if I wanted to say, pay my credit card bill by phone, all the info they needed from me WAS on the check. Maybe they have a file of the other stuff, I dunno.
Yeah, but we’re talking international payments here. I think all banks have a specific routing number into the state in which they operate for that. I too, have a couple of things charged every month out of my checking account, and you’re right, they just need what’s on the check for US stuff. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Also, I’m unsure about this SWIFT thing. I’ve given out the SWIFT number for my bank to foreign folks who have wired money. No probs. And they assured me that folks could only PLACE money in my account, that even I couldn’t send money out without showing up in person. I even have online banking and can’t do it from there. This is largest bank in the state, so I guess I’ll take them at their word. Then again, this IS just Tennersee So StefC’s post about the dangers of SWIFT (whatever exactly that is), caught my eye. I may ask again. Also, though, I try to keep less than a grand in that account at all times, as basically use it specifically for Paypal/BillPoint and the once in a blue moon wire. BTW, I’m REALLY going to miss BillPoint. Normal customers have already balked at PayPal, and once they hit $2K limit, they’ll probably be customers no more. Sigh. I will miss Billpoint too. It was just so much easier for an eBay newbie to pay that way. Cynthia
That’s for sure, but I’m more concerned about general biz payments. How many of the public at large are gonna give up their bank info, confirm it, all that tripe, to spend more than two grand with their own plastic? And I’m not a big enough biz to where a merchant account wouldn’t really hurt, as I don’t even do the minimums on plastic most months. Mac
Response:
actually, With a swift (or in the us ABA) and the account number, there is a lot of damage that can be done. Isn’t that the information on every check? For my bank, they need an entry routing number for the whole state, that’s not on the check.
Well, in times past, if I wanted to say, pay my credit card bill by phone, all the info they needed from me WAS on the check. Maybe they have a file of the other stuff, I dunno. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Also, I’m unsure about this SWIFT thing. I’ve given out the SWIFT number for my bank to foreign folks who have wired money. No probs. And they assured me that folks could only PLACE money in my account, that even I couldn’t send money out without showing up in person. I even have online banking and can’t do it from there. This is largest bank in the state, so I guess I’ll take them at their word. Then again, this IS just Tennersee So StefC’s post about the dangers of SWIFT (whatever exactly that is), caught my eye. I may ask again. Also, though, I try to keep less than a grand in that account at all times, as basically use it specifically for Paypal/BillPoint and the once in a blue moon wire. BTW, I’m REALLY going to miss BillPoint. Normal customers have already balked at PayPal, and once they hit $2K limit, they’ll probably be customers no more. Sigh.
I will miss Billpoint too. It was just so much easier for an eBay newbie to pay that way. Cynthia
Response:
Drafts on accounts are easy as heck to do in the US if you have the routing number and account number. According to Clark Howard of Atlanta radio (www.clarkhoward.com) banks here don’t verify drafts. The bank gets the printed draft, and the funds go out of your account. Simple as that. All they need is a laser printer with a MICR (magnetic ink) toner cartridge. I worked for a payroll company where a guy got busted. He was using their check printer to generate checks for other people’s accounts. All told he had cleared $75,000 by the time they caught him. Just punched in the account # and routing #, zipped out a draft, presented it for cashing to a random party store, and the party stores were having no problems cashing the checks. So much for security. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -actually, With a swift (or in the us ABA) and the account number, there is a lot of damage that can be done. As a manager of a bigger bank, I see it all the time. Sometimes they make up checks with your account info and their fake name. Other cases, they pay bills claiming to be you. (They never pay your bills) The possiblies are endless. Then as the account holder you are forced to file claims and hope that you have enough money to last until the claim is settled. This can gone on for months. In the meantime, collection agents call to make good on checks written by someone else.You may not be able to write a check to your local market that you used for 20+ years. Please understand that next to your social security number,banking information is just as valuable.
Response:
actually, With a swift (or in the us ABA) and the account number, there is a lot of damage that can be done. As a manager of a bigger bank, I see it all the time. Sometimes they make up checks with your account info and their fake name. Other cases, they pay bills claiming to be you. (They never pay your bills) The possiblies are endless. Then as the account holder you are forced to file claims and hope that you have enough money to last until the claim is settled. This can gone on for months. In the meantime, collection agents call to make good on checks written by someone else.You may not be able to write a check to your local market that you used for 20+ years. Please understand that next to your social security number,banking information is just as valuable.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – New guy to ebay, tried to pay me by paypal, but he wasn’t verified yet, so asked for other payment methods such as internet banking payment etc. I told him my sort code and account number At the same time, reading about passwords, I made all of my passwords more secure by using random mixtures of letters and numbers Then I forgot to save it in my password protected organiser, so I had to complete security. Believe it or not, just completing my account number was sufficient for me to regain control of my account Before you say I shouldn’t give him my details, this could happen to anyone – e.g. you may pay someone small amounts by paypal, large amounts by cheque. The receiver will have your email address (paypal login) and account number – enough to do what I did. Very scary indeed This is a very confusing post. You seem to be talking about your actual bank account number and your paypal account. With your bank account routing stuff, they can only PUT money in there. With your PayPal account, they need your password. I don’t see how these interact? Obviously, if someone has your PayPal password, they can do all kinds of things, including draining money from your bank account. Wanna clear that up? Mac
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declared: New guy to ebay, tried to pay me by paypal, but he wasn’t verified yet, so asked for other payment methods such as internet banking payment etc. I told him my sort code and account number At the same time, reading about passwords, I made all of my passwords more secure by using random mixtures of letters and numbers Then I forgot to save it in my password protected organiser, so I had to complete security. Believe it or not, just completing my account number was sufficient for me to regain control of my account Before you say I shouldn’t give him my details, this could happen to anyone – e.g. you may pay someone small amounts by paypal, large amounts by cheque. The receiver will have your email address (paypal login) and account number – enough to do what I did. Very scary indeed
i don’t get it, he hacked into your computer and got your password? robert 36 years of providing clues to the clueless at no extra charge.
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New guy to ebay, tried to pay me by paypal, but he wasn’t verified yet, so asked for other payment methods such as internet banking payment etc. I told him my sort code and account number At the same time, reading about passwords, I made all of my passwords more secure by using random mixtures of letters and numbers Then I forgot to save it in my password protected organiser, so I had to complete security. Believe it or not, just completing my account number was sufficient for me to regain control of my account Before you say I shouldn’t give him my details, this could happen to anyone – e.g. you may pay someone small amounts by paypal, large amounts by cheque. The receiver will have your email address (paypal login) and account number – enough to do what I did. Very scary indeed — Mike
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: New guy to ebay, tried to pay me by paypal, but he wasn’t verified yet, : so asked for other payment methods such as internet banking payment etc. : I told him my sort code and account number : : At the same time, reading about passwords, I made all of my passwords : more secure by using random mixtures of letters and numbers : : Then I forgot to save it in my password protected organiser, so I had to : complete security. Believe it or not, just completing my account number : was sufficient for me to regain control of my account : : Before you say I shouldn’t give him my details, this could happen to : anyone – e.g. you may pay someone small amounts by paypal, large amounts : by cheque. The receiver will have your email address (paypal login) and : account number – enough to do what I did. Very scary indeed : — : Mike Mike, I don’t understand what you mean. Did you give him your password?
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New guy to ebay, tried to pay me by paypal, but he wasn’t verified yet, so asked for other payment methods such as internet banking payment etc. I told him my sort code and account number At the same time, reading about passwords, I made all of my passwords more secure by using random mixtures of letters and numbers Then I forgot to save it in my password protected organiser, so I had to complete security. Believe it or not, just completing my account number was sufficient for me to regain control of my account Before you say I shouldn’t give him my details, this could happen to anyone – e.g. you may pay someone small amounts by paypal, large amounts by cheque. The receiver will have your email address (paypal login) and account number – enough to do what I did. Very scary indeed
This is a very confusing post. You seem to be talking about your actual bank account number and your paypal account. With your bank account routing stuff, they can only PUT money in there. With your PayPal account, they need your password. I don’t see how these interact? Obviously, if someone has your PayPal password, they can do all kinds of things, including draining money from your bank account. Wanna clear that up? Mac
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