Question:
Update to the sword refund mess I posted on a few weeks ago. I use Square Trade. I thought they were a fair and impartial mediator when I first heard from them. A buyer contacted them when I refused a refund on the grounds that he altered the merchandise. Square Trade went to great lengths to present themselves as "not working for either side". The mediator asked me questions that lead me to believe that he was gathering the facts of the case but he was actually working to get the complaintant an undeserved refund. A pressured settlement at any cost, fair or unfair. I pointed out the fact, many times, that the complaintant was not intitled to a refund and that I was not prepared to suffer a financial loss because of the alterations (basically destroyed the value) the buyer made to the antique Japanese Samurai sword. I was told that I was letting my emotions stand in the way of a settlement. Bullcrap, may I say!!! After I refused to offer a refund for the fourth time the mediator said he would close the case. He did. I am posting the first message from the mediator that details Square Trades role. Just for reference to anyone who considers using Square Trade: "By agreeing to mediation, you have taken a positive step toward resolving your differences. I am not a judge nor do I decide the outcome of your case. You have the responsibility to work out an agreement. As a mediator, I do not find fault or assess blame.I do not give legal advice nor do represent either party. If we reach a point where we cannot conclude an agreement, I have two options: I can recommend a solution but only if I have permission from both of you. You also retain your right whether to accept my recommendation. The other option is to close the case which leaves you in the same position that you are currently in. I will be asking you for information to clarify the issues in this situation and to explore possibilities for settlement. " There maybe situations where buyers and sellers are not cooperative and need help dealing with each other and Square Trade could be of some help. In cases like mine, where a settlement is not desired or warranted, I can see NO benefit from using them or participating in the worthless process. I contacted Ebay powersellers support and trust and safety {as many posters instructed me to do} and got the a unified response on this issue: Sellers are not obligated to give refunds on any auction. In my case specifically they said that a fraud investigation, if filed by the buyer, would not result in a finding against me if the customer altered the item. The buyer must have been aware of this fact because he didn’t bother to file. I initailly offered a full refund plus split shipping before I was aware of the changes made by the buyer. The issue was not my unwillingmess. The issue was that the piece had been altered. I do not know of any business that would lay down for such a thing. How many of you sellers out there have given refund for altered or damaged items? Say, you sell a shirt. The cust. receives it and emails you that it was not as described. Cust say that he/she thought blue meant dark blue (eventhough you showed 12 photos of your pale blue shirt) You say, Ok you are unhappy with your purchase, send it back and we can split the loss on shipping. You can relist your blue shirt, right? No problem. Cust emails again. Great I will put in in the mail tomorrow by the way I cut the sleeves off. I thought maybe I would like the blue better if it was a short sleeved shirt…. What would you do? Any other refund nightmares out there? Amy
Response:
I mean it equates to dropping a Rolex while viewing at the Jewelers. Whether you wanted to spend that much or liked the style, it’s yours once you damage it.
It’s not the same at all, only one person can tell me the Rolex is now mine from an accident as above, that be a judge! Even if I have a drunk lawyer I’ll bet I don’t pay for the watch… 
Jim A. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Mason, I feel for you. It seems pretty cut and dry that you should not provide a refund. Good luck. -Bub
Response:
Thanks! I have not heard a word from the guy since the closing of the mediation. We loaded the shotgun, just in case he goes "postal" (no offense to the postally employed). He claims he is too distraught to even look at the sword. Someone on this NG suggested he put it in the closet so it will not be a daily reminder of how damn dumb he is. Not to say that I have no sympathy. I mean it equates to dropping a Rolex while viewing at the Jewelers. Whether you wanted to spend that much or liked the style, it’s yours once you damage it. It stinks for the weenie and I am sorry he screwed up like that, cost him big $’s. I am creating a me page of terms like some sellers have. Spells it all out, leaves nothing to the imagination of bidders. I debated the idea of even mentioning the R word but after this experience it seems necessary. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Mason, I feel for you. It seems pretty cut and dry that you should not provide a refund. Good luck. -Bub
Response:
Hi Mason, I feel for you. It seems pretty cut and dry that you should not provide a refund. Good luck. -Bub – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Update to the sword refund mess I posted on a few weeks ago. I use Square Trade. I thought they were a fair and impartial mediator when I first heard from them. A buyer contacted them when I refused a refund on the grounds that he altered the merchandise. Square Trade went to great lengths to present themselves as "not working for either side". The mediator asked me questions that lead me to believe that he was gathering the facts of the case but he was actually working to get the complaintant an undeserved refund. A pressured settlement at any cost, fair or unfair. I pointed out the fact, many times, that the complaintant was not intitled to a refund and that I was not prepared to suffer a financial loss because of the alterations (basically destroyed the value) the buyer made to the antique Japanese Samurai sword. I was told that I was letting my emotions stand in the way of a settlement. Bullcrap, may I say!!! After I refused to offer a refund for the fourth time the mediator said he would close the case. He did. I am posting the first message from the mediator that details Square Trades role. Just for reference to anyone who considers using Square Trade: "By agreeing to mediation, you have taken a positive step toward resolving your differences. I am not a judge nor do I decide the outcome of your case. You have the responsibility to work out an agreement. As a mediator, I do not find fault or assess blame.I do not give legal advice nor do represent either party. If we reach a point where we cannot conclude an agreement, I have two options: I can recommend a solution but only if I have permission from both of you. You also retain your right whether to accept my recommendation. The other option is to close the case which leaves you in the same position that you are currently in. I will be asking you for information to clarify the issues in this situation and to explore possibilities for settlement. " There maybe situations where buyers and sellers are not cooperative and need help dealing with each other and Square Trade could be of some help. In cases like mine, where a settlement is not desired or warranted, I can see NO benefit from using them or participating in the worthless process. I contacted Ebay powersellers support and trust and safety {as many posters instructed me to do} and got the a unified response on this issue: Sellers are not obligated to give refunds on any auction. In my case specifically they said that a fraud investigation, if filed by the buyer, would not result in a finding against me if the customer altered the item. The buyer must have been aware of this fact because he didn’t bother to file. I initailly offered a full refund plus split shipping before I was aware of the changes made by the buyer. The issue was not my unwillingmess. The issue was that the piece had been altered. I do not know of any business that would lay down for such a thing. How many of you sellers out there have given refund for altered or damaged items? Say, you sell a shirt. The cust. receives it and emails you that it was not as described. Cust say that he/she thought blue meant dark blue (eventhough you showed 12 photos of your pale blue shirt) You say, Ok you are unhappy with your purchase, send it back and we can split the loss on shipping. You can relist your blue shirt, right? No problem. Cust emails again. Great I will put in in the mail tomorrow by the way I cut the sleeves off. I thought maybe I would like the blue better if it was a short sleeved shirt…. What would you do? Any other refund nightmares out there? Amy
Before you buy.
Response:
I pointed out the fact, many times, that the complaintant was not intitled to a refund and that I was not prepared to suffer a financial loss because of the alterations (basically destroyed the value) the buyer made to the antique Japanese Samurai sword. I was told that I was letting my emotions stand in the way of a settlement. Bullcrap, may I say!!! After I refused to offer a refund for the fourth time the mediator said he would close the case. He did.
Glad you stood your ground. That loser *ruined* that sword (I’m no expert, but I have some experience with antique arms and armour.)
Response:
Welcome to the wonderful world of mediation. Having dealt with it numerous times in a profession capacity, I can tell you that all mediation is generally the same. Both parties are told by the mediator that their point of view is without merit, with the idea that both parties can be pressured into reaching some sort of middle ground. If your basic position is that you owe nothing, then mediation is pointless. It isn’t like arbtration, where someone reviews both side’s positions, and gives their opinion on how the dispute should be decided. Richard Ward – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Update to the sword refund mess I posted on a few weeks ago. I use Square Trade. I thought they were a fair and impartial mediator when I first heard from them. A buyer contacted them when I refused a refund on the grounds that he altered the merchandise. Square Trade went to great lengths to present themselves as "not working for either side". The mediator asked me questions that lead me to believe that he was gathering the facts of the case but he was actually working to get the complaintant an undeserved refund. A pressured settlement at any cost, fair or unfair. I pointed out the fact, many times, that the complaintant was not intitled to a refund and that I was not prepared to suffer a financial loss because of the alterations (basically destroyed the value) the buyer made to the antique Japanese Samurai sword. I was told that I was letting my emotions stand in the way of a settlement. Bullcrap, may I say!!! After I refused to offer a refund for the fourth time the mediator said he would close the case. He did. I am posting the first message from the mediator that details Square Trades role. Just for reference to anyone who considers using Square Trade: "By agreeing to mediation, you have taken a positive step toward resolving your differences. I am not a judge nor do I decide the outcome of your case. You have the responsibility to work out an agreement. As a mediator, I do not find fault or assess blame.I do not give legal advice nor do represent either party. If we reach a point where we cannot conclude an agreement, I have two options: I can recommend a solution but only if I have permission from both of you. You also retain your right whether to accept my recommendation. The other option is to close the case which leaves you in the same position that you are currently in. I will be asking you for information to clarify the issues in this situation and to explore possibilities for settlement. " There maybe situations where buyers and sellers are not cooperative and need help dealing with each other and Square Trade could be of some help. In cases like mine, where a settlement is not desired or warranted, I can see NO benefit from using them or participating in the worthless process. I contacted Ebay powersellers support and trust and safety {as many posters instructed me to do} and got the a unified response on this issue: Sellers are not obligated to give refunds on any auction. In my case specifically they said that a fraud investigation, if filed by the buyer, would not result in a finding against me if the customer altered the item. The buyer must have been aware of this fact because he didn’t bother to file. I initailly offered a full refund plus split shipping before I was aware of the changes made by the buyer. The issue was not my unwillingmess. The issue was that the piece had been altered. I do not know of any business that would lay down for such a thing. How many of you sellers out there have given refund for altered or damaged items? Say, you sell a shirt. The cust. receives it and emails you that it was not as described. Cust say that he/she thought blue meant dark blue (eventhough you showed 12 photos of your pale blue shirt) You say, Ok you are unhappy with your purchase, send it back and we can split the loss on shipping. You can relist your blue shirt, right? No problem. Cust emails again. Great I will put in in the mail tomorrow by the way I cut the sleeves off. I thought maybe I would like the blue better if it was a short sleeved shirt…. What would you do? Any other refund nightmares out there? Amy
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