Question:
"Frank Ross" wrote (Ted Sallis) wrote <snip TS This Message is: *TOTALLY APPROVED* BY ABSOLUTE AUTOCRATIC COMMAND OF O.C. & STIGGS WHILE DRUNK Posting to Usenet while drunk constitutes a breach of eBay rules and can result in suspension of your hic-count. Frank
Not around here: join the party: http://snurl.com/xhh 
link
Response:
"Frank Ross" wrote <snip here, snip there: snip, snip, snip Does anyone who matters inside eBay read this ng? Frank
I’m a paypal shill. If I do well, ebay may transfer me to the auction action. link
Response:
What can I do with eBay, Don, to make it less likely that he will neg me, or more likely that they will remove the neg if he does?
You can’t, but you can report the abusive email to ebaY. You can also get a US friend to bid and receive for you. — The TV business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free and good men die like dogs. There’s also a negative side. – Hunter Thompson
Response:
Which (how many) of the above?
Report him to ebaY for being abusive, and for not completing the transaction. Wont prevent a neg. Otherwise lay low for 120 days and come back and ask how to neg him through the back door. — The TV business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free and good men die like dogs. There’s also a negative side. – Hunter Thompson
Response:
"Fred A. Murphy" wrote Which (how many) of the above? Report him to ebaY for being abusive, and for not completing the transaction. Wont prevent a neg. Otherwise lay low for 120 days and come back and ask how to neg him through the back door.
I turned Frank onto it already, elsewhere in the thread. ;) link
Response:
You can also get a US friend to bid and receive for you.
– Hunter Thompson Which, for certain auction items, constitutes a criminal act. — Many thanks, Don Lancaster Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552 Please visit my GURU’s LAIR web site at http://www.tinaja.com
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – On Wednesday I won an auction (the final price was close to $150) where the seller had specified "Will ship to United States only." Nowhere at all in the auction details did he suggest that the bidders had to be in the States. Just that he would only ship to the States. Fine by me. While I live in Europe, I have many friends in the U.S. who are willing to forward things on to me, and I’ve used this way on eBay many times. There was no problem about meeting his requirement for type of payment ($ money order). I emailed him a couple days before the auction ended, mentioning this. I got no answer, happens sometimes, not everyone checks their email each day. After the auction ended, I waited an hour for any communication from the seller. Receiving none, I emailed the seller, saying that while it would be great if he could ship to me in Europe, I had an address in the States that he should use if he couldn’t. I said I would send payment by Bidpay (Western Union money order) as soon as he let me know the postal cost of the option he chose. Three days of silence. Then I get an abusive email from the seller, which quoted the whole of my polite and friendly email with just one line added by him — "Fuck off cunt I do not deal with foreign asshols". Could it be he is just too plumb stupid to realise that "Will ship to United States only." is not the same as "Will only sell to bidders living in the United States."? What should I do? Report him to eBay? How? I don’t want him to spoil my feedback profile. How can I stop him? His feedback is pretty good, but he has picked up 0.5% negs. I would like to get the item I won. HELP! Frank
This seller is really out of line. Unless you are french…in which case I would also tell you to F*#K OFF.
Response:
Then I get an abusive email from the seller, which quoted the whole of my polite and friendly email with just one line added by him — "Fuck off cunt I do not deal with foreign asshols".
Assuming you really want the item (as you claimed, but later said you don’t want anything from him), you could take a deep breath, and: Tell him you’re an American citizen currently abroad, and how you wish you could return already! But are stuck there for a while longer. Butter his ears with patriotic chatter. After you get the item, if it works, you know what to do. And don’t tell him I suggested it.
Response:
You can also get a US friend to bid and receive for you. – Hunter Thompson Which, for certain auction items, constitutes a criminal act.
What items would those be? I can’t see any criminal act being committed by having a friend bid on and recieve an item. I could imagine possible criminal acts being committed by shipping certain items overseas, though.
Response:
But you’re gonna neg him in July. ;) And here’s how:
Just a side opinion. I think we should avoid posting this information, even though I realize it can be looked up in the archives. Just give it out to people in email. If it becomes common knowledge, ebaY will either change it so it doesn’t work, or the very people who deserve to be negged will find out about it, and use it to neg back, or worse, use it on people who won’t know how to return fire. That will reduce its utility as a negging tool, and make it merely a convenience for delayed leaving of FB. I mean it’s just that we’ve got this really cool weapon, no sense in giving the plans to the enemy, eh? — If the Internet was a real super-highway it would be traveled by slow moving garbage trucks with big flashing corporate logos on them, little kids riding tricycles carrying supersoakers filled with battery acid, and HUGE yellow schoolbuses with America Online painted on them, filled with kids throwing shit out of the windows.
Response:
I won’t push the analogy too far, except for the super-rare cases when the buyer and seller physically meet and hand over the item,
I’ve had six in-persons that I recall, including one just yesterday, and probably a half dozen others that just weren’t quite convenient enough. Of course, I have a retail location, but it’s not quite as rare as you might think. — If the Internet was a real super-highway it would be traveled by slow moving garbage trucks with big flashing corporate logos on them, little kids riding tricycles carrying supersoakers filled with battery acid, and HUGE yellow schoolbuses with America Online painted on them, filled with kids throwing shit out of the windows.
Response:
Does anyone who matters inside eBay read this ng?
Gawd, I hope not! — If the Internet was a real super-highway it would be traveled by slow moving garbage trucks with big flashing corporate logos on them, little kids riding tricycles carrying supersoakers filled with battery acid, and HUGE yellow schoolbuses with America Online painted on them, filled with kids throwing shit out of the windows.
Response:
I’m a paypal shill. If I do well, ebay may transfer me to the auction action.
First you run the approval desk at the unction junction. — If the Internet was a real super-highway it would be traveled by slow moving garbage trucks with big flashing corporate logos on them, little kids riding tricycles carrying supersoakers filled with battery acid, and HUGE yellow schoolbuses with America Online painted on them, filled with kids throwing shit out of the windows.
Response:
"Frank Ross" wrote MindElec wrote Mac McDougald declared: Report him to eBay for seller non-performance, see if that shakes it loose. and if it doesn’t move on, he’s clearly someone you probably don’t want to do business with. Wise words, Mac…. I agree.
Uh, that’s Mindelec you’re responding to, not Mac. Mac in on this thread, too, but you answered Mindelec. I want nothing from him, least of all a neg. In order to make the looming neg less likely (or less unlikely to be removed by eBay), should I lie low, or respond to him politely again and apologise, or tell him to follow his own advice and fuck off, or paypal him his listing fee (he hasn’t asked for this, and as I did nothing against eBay rules or etiquette, I can’t see why I should), or get in the first complaint to eBay (but will they remove a neg in these circumstances?), or land him a neg and to hell with it? Which (how many) of the above? Or, none of the above? Frank
Why don’t you ask ebay?! =) And don’t leave a neg for him…..yet. We can show you how to neg him after he has no apparent (apparent to him ;)) chance left to neg you. Wanna know the secret? ;) link
Response:
"Frank Ross" wrote "a. linklurker" wrote Uh, that’s Mindelec you’re responding to, not Mac. Mac in on this thread, too, but you answered Mindelec. Affirmative. But I had corrected my own error in a post after the one on which I made the error. I corrected it with: You, or your usenet provider, may have overlooked this when you repeated the correction one and a half hours after I had already made it.
Your correction was time-stamped earlier than my post, but landed after mine was posted. I did see yours. Credit where credit is due is due process. ;) NBD on this one, really, though. =) I want nothing from him, least of all a neg. In order to make the looming neg less likely (or less unlikely to be removed by eBay), should I lie low, or respond to him politely again and apologise, or tell him to follow his own advice and fuck off, or paypal him his listing fee (he hasn’t asked for this, and as I did nothing against eBay rules or etiquette, I can’t see why I should), or get in the first complaint to eBay (but will they remove a neg in these circumstances?), or land him a neg and to hell with it? Which (how many) of the above? Or, none of the above? Frank Why don’t you ask ebay?! =) How? More clearly, how can I ask them in a way that won’t trigger them emailing the seller too?
Well, ebay won’t reveal to them that it was you, but that of course doesn’t mean that he won’t suss it out anyway. Ask a hypothetical question. "Say, what if….?" HTH And don’t leave a neg for him…..yet. We can show you how to neg him after he has no apparent (apparent to him ;)) chance left to neg you. Wanna know the secret? ;) I can see that you know that the 89 days 23 hours 59 minutes trick does not really work. A red star seller is likely to know how to go to the page and leave the neg, I think / fink, I mean $$$$ link $$$$.
:O ;) (I like the dollar signs bracketing my name: fitting. ;)) But you’re gonna neg him in July. ;) And here’s how: http://cgi2.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?LeaveFeedbackShow&useridto=… U&item=144442222 Put your id in where it reads ‘YOU’ and the miscreants id in where it ’says’ ‘The_Other_Person’ and swap the actual item number with ‘144442222′. Try it now, if you have an old transaction that you never left any feedback on way-back-when. ;) If you think I have missed something, please tell me. Thanks. Frank
No, you’re thinking it through very logically. And asking good questions. Hopefully, you can avoid a neg, and maybe get this guy spanked, too. At least you can neg him with no fear of retaliation, come summer. link
Response:
the auction and explained the arrangement and asked if it was okay to bid. Basically now you have sprung a suprise on him and he is shipping to a second party which opens up several cans of worms for him liability-wise. I’ll wager the auction ended, he looked at your feedback and saw it was in Europe and got really pissed. You’ll have a hard time settling him down now. In case you are not aware, many in the US are not all that thrilled with Europeans right now. It’s irrational to let that interfere with your ebaying (fortune passes everywhere and all that) but who ever said Americans are rational right? If it was me, I’d send it to your US address and say thank you very much.
Well, seems to me you followed the rules and he didn’t–also, his language was such that you don’t want anything more to do with him. No reason you should have e-mailed him first, when you knew you had a US address to give him, and a Bidpay money order is like cash. I think you should neg him good, and respond calmly and politely to the inevitable neg he will leave you. I do -not- think you should write him an apologetic letter, or any letter at all. If you are forced at any point to correspond with him, you should be polite, cold, and terse. (And if -I- were the seller, I’d be pitifully grateful that a European was willing to buy from me right now.) Bonita
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – X-No-Archive: Yes If they say they will ship to the United States only, most are willing to ship to a US address, even if the package is going to later be forwarded to another country. (Don Lancaster excluded of course.) So Don Lancaster is a country? ; ) You can tell that the support I’ve had here is making me feel less depressed. Thank you, everyone. The problem is simple though, if everything happened exactly as he described it, It sure did. with no important facts omitted, Only one that I can think of is that I did not explicitly say in my first post here that I emailed him not once but twice pre- auction-end. Same email was used, except the second time I added I was sending it again "just in case you did not get this the first time, as I know email isn’t always reliable." he’s dealing with an asshole, who chose to behave like a jerk, The only benefit of the doubt I can give him is that he did not read enough of the "after" email (though he responded to it) to realise that I was leaving it to him to choose between mailing it overseas or within the continental U.S. but there isn’t a great deal he can do about it. Does anyone who matters inside eBay read this ng? The seller can leave negative feedback, Is there anything I can do in advance to make it less certain that eBay will do nothing to block/remove that neg? You know, like an NPB, a NSS (Non-Selling-Seller). His email is the best evidence possible. Though asked for it in my post-auction email, he doesn’t give his street address (unless it starts with "Fuck you") – which rules out sending him payment in any of the methods he specifies in his auction listing.
I’m not trying to say you did omit something, but we’re only hearing your side of the story, and every couple of weeks someone comes by here with an odd story, and after few dozen responses mentions the facts that made the whole discussion irrelevant. That’s why I’m couching my answer the way I am, it isn’t anything personal. and eBay isn’t going to make the seller ship the item to him. As you know, I could make him pay me damages. Breach of contract works the same way his side of the pond. For the costs to me that I would not be able to reclaim, it would be lunacy on my part. The only thing he can really do is to leave negative feedback for the seller. But when?
If he doesn’t leave it for you, after neither side is able to leave it. Someone mentioned this earlier, there’s a way to leave feedback after it’s supposed to be too late. A report to eBay might keep him from getting a black mark on his record if the seller files an NPB, but it won’t get him the item. I agree it won’t get me the item. Protection is more on my mind now. How do I make such a report to eBay, Richard, in a way that is unlikely to provoke this sweetie into issuing a neg? Thanks! Frank
The only way I know how to do it is to go here: http://pages.ebay.com/help/basics/select-RS.html then select "Transaction problems", "I am a buyer", "I won the auction and the seller won’t sell me the item". As for not provoking him to into leaving you a negative, I don’t have any idea how you’d do that. When people behave irrationally, trying to come up with a way to deal with them using rational thought isn’t particularly effective. Richard Ward
Response:
<snip <snip All he had to do was reply to either of my pre-auction emails with a "Don’t bid", and I would not have bid.
Just for future reference, if this type of thing ever comes up in the future, and the seller ignores your emails, don’t bid. As you’ve found out in this situation, some people aren’t worth dealing with, whatever they’re selling, and this was a red flag to give a hint that this was that type of seller before you placed a bid. <snip Someone may be able to help me with this one. If he did file a NPB report on me, surely eBay would let me know? I haven’t been in this position before.
If he files an NPB alert, you would get a notice from eBay. If he filed a request for final value credit, you would get a second notice from ebay, and a chance to respond. I’d notify eBay now, since it will improve your case when the FVF is filed. How could he file an NPB report, when he relisted the unique item just 72 hours after the auction ended? His auction details specified a much, much longer payment period.
All he has to do to file an NPB alert is wait 7 days and fill out the form. eBay doesn’t look at the auction terms. I do not have his street address. Should I use the eBay "establish contact" link which sends out both street addresses to the buyer and seller? Frank
All it gives is the city, state and telephone number. It doesn’t give the address. Richard Ward
Response:
On Wednesday I won an auction (the final price was close to $150) where the seller had specified "Will ship to United States only."
Most are willing to Ship to Canada : ) — Please delete "REMOVE" from the e-mail address when replying. http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/coolspot18/
Response:
On Wednesday I won an auction (the final price was close to $150) where the seller had specified "Will ship to United States only." Most are willing to Ship to Canada : )
If they say they will ship to the United States only, most are willing to ship to a US address, even if the package is going to later be forwarded to another country. (Don Lancaster excluded of course.) The problem is simple though, if everything happened exactly as he described it, with no important facts omitted, he’s dealing with an asshole, who chose to behave like a jerk, but there isn’t a great deal he can do about it. The seller can leave negative feedback, and eBay isn’t going to make the seller ship the item to him. The only thing he can really do is to leave negative feedback for the seller. A report to eBay might keep him from getting a black mark on his record if the seller files an NPB, but it won’t get him the item.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -On Wednesday I won an auction (the final price was close to $150) where the seller had specified "Will ship to United States only." Nowhere at all in the auction details did he suggest that the bidders had to be in the States. Just that he would only ship to the States. Fine by me. While I live in Europe, I have many friends in the U.S. who are willing to forward things on to me, and I’ve used this way on eBay many times. There was no problem about meeting his requirement for type of payment ($ money order). I emailed him a couple days before the auction ended, mentioning this. I got no answer, happens sometimes, not everyone checks their email each day. After the auction ended, I waited an hour for any communication from the seller. Receiving none, I emailed the seller, saying that while it would be great if he could ship to me in Europe, I had an address in the States that he should use if he couldn’t. I said I would send payment by Bidpay (Western Union money order) as soon as he let me know the postal cost of the option he chose. Three days of silence. Then I get an abusive email from the seller, which quoted the whole of my polite and friendly email with just one line added by him — "Fuck off cunt I do not deal with foreign asshols". Could it be he is just too plumb stupid to realise that "Will ship to United States only." is not the same as "Will only sell to bidders living in the United States."? What should I do? Report him to eBay? How? I don’t want him to spoil my feedback profile. How can I stop him? His feedback is pretty good, but he has picked up 0.5% negs. I would like to get the item I won. HELP! Frank
You really should have contacted the seller before the end of the auction and explained the arrangement and asked if it was okay to bid. Basically now you have sprung a suprise on him and he is shipping to a second party which opens up several cans of worms for him liability-wise. I’ll wager the auction ended, he looked at your feedback and saw it was in Europe and got really pissed. You’ll have a hard time settling him down now. In case you are not aware, many in the US are not all that thrilled with Europeans right now. It’s irrational to let that interfere with your ebaying (fortune passes everywhere and all that) but who ever said Americans are rational right? If it was me, I’d send it to your US address and say thank you very much. Good Luck, TS This Message is: *TOTALLY APPROVED* BY ABSOLUTE AUTOCRATIC COMMAND OF O.C. & STIGGS WHILE DRUNK
Response:
something like: [snip] I emailed him a couple days before the auction ended, mentioning this. I got no answer, happens sometimes, not everyone checks their email each day.
[snip] You really should have contacted the seller before the end of the auction and explained the arrangement and asked if it was okay to bid. Basically now you have sprung a suprise on him and he is shipping to a second party which opens up several cans of worms for him liability-wise.
Looks to me like he DID try to contact the seller, but the seller did not respond. Sure, in hindsight we can nit-pick and say he shouldn’t have bid unless he got a response–but he was bidding on a unique item, and probably expected a reasonable person to be selling it. Even if the seller did not want to ship to a third party, there was no need to be abusive; they should have been able to settle it amicably with a "NPB by mutual consent" before he re-listed. Personally, I’d report him to eBay and take the neg. He’s likely to leave one anyway, from the sound of it. -Bertha — Willow: Oz is a werewolf. Buffy: It’s a long story. Oz: I got bit. Buffy: Apparently not that long. Faith: Hey, as long as you don’t go scratching at me or humping my leg, we’re five-by-five, ya know? Oz: Fair enough.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – X-No-Archive: Yes On Wednesday I won an auction (the final price was close to $150) where the seller had specified "Will ship to United States only." Nowhere at all in the auction details did he suggest that the bidders had to be in the States. Just that he would only ship to the States. Fine by me. While I live in Europe, I have many friends in the U.S. who are willing to forward things on to me, and I’ve used this way on eBay many times. There was no problem about meeting his requirement for type of payment ($ money order). I emailed him a couple days before the auction ended, mentioning this. I got no answer, happens sometimes, not everyone checks their email each day. After the auction ended, I waited an hour for any communication from the seller. Receiving none, I emailed the seller, saying that while it would be great if he could ship to me in Europe, I had an address in the States that he should use if he couldn’t. I said I would send payment by Bidpay (Western Union money order) as soon as he let me know the postal cost of the option he chose. Three days of silence. Then I get an abusive email from the seller, which quoted the whole of my polite and friendly email with just one line added by him — "Fuck off cunt I do not deal with foreign asshols". Could it be he is just too plumb stupid to realise that "Will ship to United States only." is not the same as "Will only sell to bidders living in the United States."? What should I do? Report him to eBay? How? I don’t want him to spoil my feedback profile. How can I stop him? His feedback is pretty good, but he has picked up 0.5% negs. I would like to get the item I won. HELP! Frank Report him to eBay for seller non-performance, see if that shakes it loose.
and if it doesn’t move on, he’s clearly someone you probably don’t want to do business with. robert "If people bring so much courage to this world the world has to kill them to break them, so of course it kills them. The world breaks every one and afterward many are strong at the broken places. But those that will not break it kills. It kills the very good and the very gentle and the very brave impartially. If you are none of these you can be sure it will kill you too but there will be no special hurry."
Response:
I would like to get the item I won. Frank
That clearly is not going to happen. — Many thanks, Don Lancaster Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552 Please visit my GURU’s LAIR web site at http://www.tinaja.com
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – X-No-Archive: Yes On Wednesday I won an auction (the final price was close to $150) where the seller had specified "Will ship to United States only." Nowhere at all in the auction details did he suggest that the bidders had to be in the States. Just that he would only ship to the States. Fine by me. While I live in Europe, I have many friends in the U.S. who are willing to forward things on to me, and I’ve used this way on eBay many times. There was no problem about meeting his requirement for type of payment ($ money order). I emailed him a couple days before the auction ended, mentioning this. I got no answer, happens sometimes, not everyone checks their email each day. After the auction ended, I waited an hour for any communication from the seller. Receiving none, I emailed the seller, saying that while it would be great if he could ship to me in Europe, I had an address in the States that he should use if he couldn’t. I said I would send payment by Bidpay (Western Union money order) as soon as he let me know the postal cost of the option he chose. Three days of silence. Then I get an abusive email from the seller, which quoted the whole of my polite and friendly email with just one line added by him — "Fuck off cunt I do not deal with foreign asshols". Could it be he is just too plumb stupid to realise that "Will ship to United States only." is not the same as "Will only sell to bidders living in the United States."? What should I do? Report him to eBay? How? I don’t want him to spoil my feedback profile. How can I stop him? His feedback is pretty good, but he has picked up 0.5% negs. I would like to get the item I won. HELP! Frank
Report him to eBay for seller non-performance, see if that shakes it loose. Mac
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